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SCCA announces new rally program (Read 15828 times)
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SCCA announces new rally program
12/13/4 at 11:04:46
 
SCCA announces new rally program
A focus on closed course events [11/12/04 - 02:47]

Sports Car Club of America, Inc. announced today (Friday) at the Performance Racing Industry show a new Closed Course Rally Program and Rally Department, combining elements of its former stage rally programs with elements of autocross and road racing.

“SCCA remains focused on providing a new direction for the future of the sport of rally,” SCCA President and CEO Steve Johnson said. “Although the environment for traditional stage rally is changing dramatically throughout North America, SCCA is committed to making rally-type competition more accessible for spectators and participants alike.”

“Part of SCCA's heritage has been its rally programs, in non-speed events such as Time Speed Distance RoadRallies, as well as closed course RallyCrosses and stage-based high-speed Performance Stage Rallies,” the five-page document detailing the program says. “As with most programs that span decades, development and adaptation is required to remain relevant with the times. In 2004, an important part of rally met a crossroads, resulting in the cancellation of one type of program, and now the creation of another.

“To better serve its members and grow the sport of rally in the United States, SCCA has crafted an all-new program to bring many of the elements making stage rally exciting together with elements of its other forms of competition. Most importantly, it is structured to address many of the insurance and liability concerns from the previous program.

“Sports Car Club of America is pleased to introduce its all-new Closed Course Rally program. Overseen by the SCCA Rally Department, the objective of the closed course rally program is to provide new membership activities that blend the elements of SCCA's traditional circuit programs (Solo and Race) with the key features of performance rally.”

Closed Course Rally features three distinct programs, including the existing RallyCross competitions, a revised RallySprint program and a new CircuitRally program. The three programs are targeted at a number of participants, including recreational rallyists in street cars, hobby rallyists in multi-purpose cars (street and rally), sportsman rallyists in fully-prepared rally cars and professional and semi-professional rallyists in fully-prepared rally cars.

Beginning in 2005, RallyCross, which is an off-road Solo (autocross), will hold approximately 125 events nationwide, with a focus on consistent operations, procedures and rules.

RallySprint combines elements of performance rally with the Performance Driving Clinic program and Club Racing. Events will be held on circuits in a primarily off-road setting. Events can either be of the lapping format, where participants navigate their cars on the course with others, or single-car events similar to hill climbs depending on the venue. Speeds will be limited in these events, as will the passing areas for a multi-car format to limit the risk of car-to-car incidents. Competition is based on fastest times turned by drivers around the course. There will be approximately 10 Regional RallySprint in 2005, expanding to 50 events by 2007.

CircuitRally is new to SCCA, combining road racing and performance rally. CircuitRally events will be held at existing motorsports facilities and feature wheel-to-wheel heat-based sprint races on mostly non-paved surfaces. Presently, there are several organizations holding similar events with motorcycles, ATVs and trucks. These organizations have thrived since adopting a controlled environment model as opposed to that of a wilderness adventure. CircuitRally fills a need for events featuring automobiles.

CircuitRally events will largely fill the void left by the cancellation of the SCCA ProRally Championship, as it is geared toward spectators and has a television-friendly format. There will be two CircuitRally events in 2004, expanding to 30 National events by 2007.

With the announcement of the Closed Course Rally program, SCCA also announced the restructuring of its Performance Rally department. Now simply called “Rally,” the department, headed by Sue Robinson, will also include RoadRally, which was previously managed by SCCA's Solo department.

Press release
SCCA

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John_Vanos
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #1 - 12/13/4 at 11:26:52
 
woah, thats not rally at all.  I wouldnt be opposed to competing in it, but it just is NOT the same....
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #2 - 12/15/4 at 13:41:41
 
I am with John, i dont think that it is nearly the same. A rally is a race against time and nature, if you go off course, you DNF. Not around in circle only turning left 4 times, this is not NASCAR!!

James
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #3 - 12/15/4 at 18:34:15
 
In my mind, rally's defining feature is that the route is
theoretically never the same twice.

Other races use real cars.
The goal of most races is to go fast.
It's the ever differing route which makes the sport of Rally unique within the racing world.

I have nothing against racing on a predetermined course.  It's enjoyed by many and rightfully so, it was not however what got me interested in racing.  Rally was the first race type event in which I really wanted to take part.

I wonder if this U.S. format change has something to do with wanting a more television friendly event.  Is their main goal increased sponsorship and ad sales etc...?  This type of commercialization is common in many areas of sport.  

Would this change benefit the Canadian Rally Championship by attracting more U.S. competitors who prefer the challenges offered by rallying to that of circuit racing?  

Who knows what the futur holds
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #4 - 12/15/4 at 18:37:19
 
Oops, I reread the original post...
It states the changes were made to address insurance concerns...  Figures!  
CARS, SCCA or FIA should set up an insurance company of it's own!
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #5 - 12/15/4 at 20:08:35
 
What ever happened to: Real Cars, Real Roads, Real Fast?
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #6 - 12/15/4 at 21:34:17
 
I'm going to sound culturally insensitive, but after seeing the extremelly dissapointing ROC this Sunday, I hope our Rally doesn't get "Americanized"  Cry

They like their cars going in purty little circles for benefits of audience that wants hotdogs while they sit & watch... that's fine.
I like a bit more wilderness to my automotorsport  Undecided
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #7 - 12/16/4 at 10:52:30
 
I've already mentioned this in the past, but it's nice to see others begin to see it.  It's not always about insurance (which I'm sure has a big part of it), but it's becoming more about advertising to centralized viewing areas, hotdog sales, and V.I.P. ticket sales. Angry  It's sad where the sport has went in the SCCA and how it may trickle up north. Cry  The recent 'Pines was a first in person event for a friend (who is a rally fan) of mine and came back well, not impressed.  From how it used to be, go figure...  I'm going to have to take him to a regional, to spark interest in viewing in person again!  

Organizers should stop trying to turn these events so commerical.  In trying to please everyone, who will ultimately be happiest, sponsors?  Sure it costs money to rally, didn't it always?  Enthusiasts used to compete for the love of the sport.  If that 's not enough now for some, they should look to a different racing series, maybe oval-track?
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #8 - 12/16/4 at 12:06:03
 
You are confusing the two topics.  They are one in the same.  Read the CARS safety plan first off to understand what is now required of rallies.  All the organizers are doing is trying to make your spectating experience a better one.  Hotdog stands or not spectators are stuch there, so why not have some food and drink to go with it?  Its a fact of rally now, sorry.

John
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #9 - 12/16/4 at 12:30:05
 
luv2drift wrote on 12/16/4 at 10:52:30:
I've already mentioned this in the past, but it's nice to see others begin to see it.  It's not always about insurance (which I'm sure has a big part of it), but it's becoming more about advertising to centralized viewing areas, hotdog sales, and V.I.P. ticket sales. Angry  It's sad where the sport has went in the SCCA and how it may trickle up north. Cry  The recent 'Pines was a first in person event for a friend (who is a rally fan) of mine and came back well, not impressed.  From how it used to be, go figure...  I'm going to have to take him to a regional, to spark interest in viewing in person again!  

Organizers should stop trying to turn these events so commerical.  In trying to please everyone, who will ultimately be happiest, sponsors?  Sure it costs money to rally, didn't it always?  Enthusiasts used to compete for the love of the sport.  If that 's not enough now for some, they should look to a different racing series, maybe oval-track?

I would be interested in getting some feedback about what you and your friend didn't like. I have been involved with setting up the spactator points at Tall Pines for the last 4 years and would like the feedback.

If it was the restriction of spectating points, like John said, get used to it. Even the regionals have to follow the CARS safety plan. Last year at Black Bear, there was only two locations to view from and you had to walk into both of them. It is "all about the insurance".

Look at what happened in the U.S. Why? More than anything, I am willing to bet, is because two spectators died. Drivers, co-drivers and active participants accept the risk, but even with that their relatives may sue. However, the death of spectators is a whole different issue and I believe a significant factor in the SCCA's decision to get out of Rally and into closed course side-by-side racing.  

Edit: In respect of the use of the word "Rally", you will notice that I did not use it in reference to the closed course racing described above.
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« Last Edit: 12/16/4 at 16:13:22 by Dave Cotie »  

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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #10 - 12/16/4 at 14:10:40
 
I guess this is my newbiness speaking; but are these organizations similar in basic concept to how I see RSO/CARS, i.e. a hierarchical orientation of participants (volunteers, crews, drivers, etc - members), as opposed to commercial entities?
Would/how can these changes happen without support from "the masses"?

edit: dam; re-read the announcement and want to cry at the ludicrous spin & silliness. There's something majestic about a wilderness rally that few other sports can approach. It's really, I firmly believe, an ultimate test of man & machine, and the whole point is that it is NOT some tightly controlled, laboratory format. The purity cannot possibly remain in the events they are describing. If they want to hold them, more power to them, but they should not taint the word "rally" thusly.

(anybody holding a trademark on the word rally?Wink)
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #11 - 12/16/4 at 15:29:35
 
luv2drift wrote on 12/16/4 at 10:52:30:
I've already mentioned this in the past, but it's nice to see others begin to see it.  It's not always about insurance (which I'm sure has a big part of it), but it's becoming more about advertising to centralized viewing areas, hotdog sales, and V.I.P. ticket sales. Angry

Nobody is forcing you to buy into the VIP program, but the fact that it has sold out the last two years suggests that we are doing something right.

Quote:
Organizers should stop trying to turn these events so commerical.  In trying to please everyone, who will ultimately be happiest, sponsors?  Sure it costs money to rally, didn't it always?  Enthusiasts used to compete for the love of the sport.  If that 's not enough now for some, they should look to a different racing series, maybe oval-track?

It's easy to say "Sure it costs money to rally, didn't it always?"  But I've seen first-hand what it costs to rally and put on a rally, and the costs are perennially rising.  The situation will be even more serious next year because the national events are going to have to deal with the loss of a significant amount of RDG/Subaru sponsorship money.

We could hike the entry fees (again), which could price a lot of teams out of the sport.  Or we can chase sponsors, who like and expect the event to put on more of a show when there aren't any cars going by.  As far as expenses are concerned, there isn't a whole lot of fat to trim.  Nobody is getting rich from this sport.

What do you suggest we do?

And as far as "Enthusiasts used to compete for the love of the sport", well, that's just insulting.  Just ask any of the big teams and drivers how much they spend out of their own pockets "for the love of the sport".  They might even be too embarrassed to tell you the real amount.  I have an idea of what a Production-class team will spend in an average year, and I can tell you that an Open-class team spends exponentially more.

The old days are gone for good.  They were great, but the world has changed, and we have to adapt.
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #12 - 12/16/4 at 17:05:02
 
Dave Cotie wrote on 12/16/4 at 12:30:05:
I would be interested in getting some feedback about what you and your friend didn't like. I have been involved with setting up the spactator points at Tall Pines for the last 4 years and would like the feedback.  If it was the restriction of spectating points, like John said, get used to it.


Although he did mention some good spectator viewing areas, he did mention the commercialism feel of it and the 'controlling'/restrictions.

Dave Cotie wrote on 12/16/4 at 12:30:05:
Even the regionals have to follow the CARS safety plan. Last year at Black Bear, there was only two locations to view from and you had to walk into both of them. It is "all about the insurance".


They got the to regionals too?  Nooooo!

Dave Cotie wrote on 12/16/4 at 12:30:05:
Look at what happened in the U.S. Why? More than anything, I am willing to bet, is because two spectators died.


Of course it is.  It's terrible what happened, but God forbid anybody be responsible for their own actions.  Until we lose this 'someone must pay' attitude, insurance will continue to pay out then raise coverage costs and restrictions.  Sorry, I tend to jump topic to topic when I'm passionate about something!
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #13 - 12/16/4 at 20:35:19
 
hm, must've felt different from the volunteer side, but Tall Pines felt *sooo* non-commercial - especially the night stages! If anything, there was a feeling of raw chaos and excitement during the night... far contrasting the "seat 32-D, section 7, row H" feeling of the closed/stadium stages Sad
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Re: SCCA announces new rally program
Reply #14 - 12/16/4 at 21:11:01
 
luv2drift wrote on 12/16/4 at 17:05:02:
Although he did mention some good spectator viewing areas, he did mention the commercialism feel of it and the 'controlling'/restrictions.


They got the to regionals too?  Nooooo!


Of course it is.  It's terrible what happened, but God forbid anybody be responsible for their own actions.  Until we lose this 'someone must pay' attitude, insurance will continue to pay out then raise coverage costs and restrictions.  Sorry, I tend to jump topic to topic when I'm passionate about something!


Of course the regionals have been affected, they are run under CARS Safety plans too. You're not going to find VIP areas and such, but the spectator point restrictions and safety requirements are the same.

Unfortunately that is not the legal climate in North America. I am all for personal responsibility, but that is just not reality and the average Joe doesn't really want it that way. Car accidents - they are not accidents, most of them are as predictable as the sun rising and falling. No one has openly discussed the accidents in the U.S., so we have not had the opportunity to learn from them. This is probably as a result of lawsuits. We don't know if the spectators were in a bad spot, or the car landed funny or what and probably will never know.

We are "controlling" because we have to be.

As for the "commercialism", some like it. Like Alan said, the VIP stuff has sold out 2 years in a row, and well before the rally too.

If you're buddy wants to avoid some of this, get a HAM License and volunteer. You won't believe some of the out of the way spots you will get to!  Grin Sometimes you're lucky if you get to eat (only if you bring your own lunch).
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« Last Edit: 12/17/4 at 14:18:40 by Dave Cotie »  

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