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2011 FourStar MLRC Rallycross Championship (Read 66345 times)
Justadrive
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Re: 2011 FourStar MLRC Rallycross Championship
Reply #120 - 03/17/12 at 08:50:08
 
Dave Cotie wrote on 03/16/12 at 23:15:42:
Jeff, I personally have seen a number of threads on a number of websites from people who have found the "perfect" place to rally cross. They think they have everything lined up and then when they tell the owner what they are going to do - NO WAY!

Right now MLRC is probably happy that they have somewhere.

I think a number of people have tried to find places closer to the GTA and have failed. It probably would draw more people, but for me it would actually be a longer drive. I am sure that if you find somewhere for a rally-X to run, people would embrace it.

I too have sold my rally-X car and I am not sure that I will rally-X its replacement as I plan to DD it.

I think the track may be a victim of the success of the program. It is mostly a sand base and by the time 40 cars get 6 runs in a day, even with DNF's it is probably seeing 200 runs. Plus the fact that to get those 6 runs, they probably only get 1 or 2 chances to re-grade the track, it ends up being pretty rough.

The last time I ran, I tore up my exhaust system, however with the mileage on the car, I do know that the first flange that broke was already pretty rusty. I ran 3 times and have run my Outback over the Black Bear roads and was still running on stock Outback (KYB) struts. They were still fine when i sold the car.


Dave,

I agree "they  (MLRC)" is happy they have a place. No "work" is required. They just have to go there, set-up, run the event and leave. Simple, they are inside as well warm and toasty. Bathrooms, place to eat etc... all great stuff.

Regards to suspension lasting.....  You were lucky and some suspension will last longer... risk of bending or breaking suspension there... It happens all day every event! On a field I doubt it will ever happen to anyone! Makes the sport less expensive.

Personally I would drive another 2 hrs away to a field where I could almost guarantee myself that I am driving home with ZERO issues.

The point is simple.... its too easy for the MLRC club to set up where it is now so they are leaving it there. They really do not care about the carnage to the cars and  the cost involved by the drivers to keep up the repairs.

IF MLRC wants drivers back and obtain new drivers and get 100 people there per event then they MUST look at another venue.

And just because you fail in finding a place does NOT mean you should stop looking.

Thanks for posting your comments... Smiley
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Jeff Lehmann


2016 Optima LX ECO TURBO
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rosswood
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Re: 2011 FourStar MLRC Rallycross Championship
Reply #121 - 03/17/12 at 23:31:12
 
Jeff,

We would love to find a RallyCross course closer to the GTA and would love to have a variety of courses and would love to have smooth courses. All of this we have been trying to accomplish for over 20 years.

It is extremely difficult. Since I set up the first RX course in Ontario in Bridgenorth in the early 1980's, I know of at least 10 courses that have come and gone - none have lasted more than three years other than the current course for a wide variety of reasons.

Most common problem is loss of permission because landowners get hassled by neighbours, by the municipality, decide they are getting nothing out of it etc etc.

Every club that has tried it has given up except MLRC - again for a variety of reasons - too much work, too much expense, too much hassle.

And you are totally wrong about it being simple for MLRC - for every day we run a RX up in Bancroft I average three days up there supervising work on the course. MLRC has spent over $10,000 on that course so far, believe it or not. If you think you can just run on a field, you are totally wrong. You have to constantly be working on it, because no matter what course you use, it gets torn up. We are extremely fortunate to have such strong support from the Town of Bancroft in providing the machinery to work on the course.

The ideal venue is a large gravel pit. We have had a couple and almost had a couple more, but invariably lose them, usually because they are pressured by neighbours and community to stop allowing the Rallycrosses.

I have had at least 20 people tell me they know of a great site, but not one has ever panned out. Provide us with a lead and I guarantee that we will follow up on it.

We are very fortunate to have what we have in Bancroft. Until something better shows up, perhaps serious competitors will have to pony up for suspension and tires. Pretty cheap investment really.

Meanwhile the Rallycrosses are serving their main purpose beautifully - to provide an inexpensive opportunity for grassroots experience that leads into performance rally. Take a look at how many of the RX drivers have moved up. That and the continued high entry numbers speaks for itself.
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Re: 2011 FourStar MLRC Rallycross Championship
Reply #122 - 03/18/12 at 02:20:27
 
Ross makes very good points.  Setting up a Rally-x is not as simple as people make it out to be, and finding a location where people will not complain is next to impossible.  I would like to thank Ross and rest of the organizers for putting these events on.

Using “Golton SS stage” as a rally-x is a good idea, but as some mentioned becomes very rough after 2 rounds, and is really bad in certain spots by end of the day.  Having gravel rally tires is the best solution for this (used gravel tires can be picked up for cheap), and they will last you for many years of rally-x’s.  Skid plate is also highly recommended.  Actual rally suspension is not needed. I have been running stock suspension (struts) for all rally-x’s.  

Using the Golton SS has a side benefit, as you can “kind of” compare your times against actual Rally cars from Tall Pines. (yes, I know there are few differences between the Rally-x and the actual SS stage)

Here are my 2 cents on current rally-x.

The summer rally-x events are great, can be very, very dusty on certain days, but generally they are great.
However the winter events (as someone mentioned) need to change!  The track is plowed very narrow, and after one round you were basically a rail-car, driving/following a set of tracks between snow banks.  NOT FUN !!  And, if you get out of the tracks, you are most likely stuck in a snow bank, followed by 30 minutes of NOT FUN for anyone till you get pulled out.  
In the winter events the track should be plowed at least 2 widths of a car or wider, so you can go sideways (remember we are there to have fun and drive sideways), and not drive in ruts. At least I am anyway.  
Then you have the 6 hour “there and back” commute, to drive five 1 minute rounds in snow ruts, IMHO it’s not really worth it.
I stopped going to the winter events for that reason.

One of the complaints I heard from few competitors was that they were unhappy with the same starting order in some of the events. They had a high starting number and were near the end of every run. By the time their turn came up, the course was destroyed no matter when it was fixed between runs. They didn’t go back for another event for this reason.  Yes, it’s an excuse, and you can’t please everyone, but they do have a point on that.
How about rotating the starting order, something like,  1st round start at car 1.   2nd round start at car 11.   3rd round start at car 21…etc. and this would solve that particular issue.  We used to do that years ago.

I personally preferred the old Gravel Pit in L’Amable. I am talking the actual gravel pit where we used to run the Rally-x’s in the late 90’s and early 2000’s, and not the back parking lot area where the Tall Pines service is now.  In the pit, we had different track/route combinations, this also made it a bit more interesting. Plus having a 2 day event (Saturday and Sunday) was better.  You got way more runs in  Grin .  
 
I also want the old winter Drive-X’s series back,  ya, Ross, this is me wishing    Roll Eyes


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Re: 2011 FourStar MLRC Rallycross Championship
Reply #123 - 03/18/12 at 09:39:01
 
Thanks for the good comments.

Things we can fairly easily change at Golton:

(1) more variety of course layout and direction - will mean slightly more down time between runs. Will also mean spending a bit more money making course changes and a minor change in the Finish Timing eqpt needed (just a longer wire - maybe $75).

(2) wider plowing in winter - BTW the deal is that the Town of Bancroft provides the equipment and fuel and we pay the operator. So that would mean a bit more time required from the operator and thus a bit more expense. Also slightly more down time between runs.

(3) more change in the running order - a no brainer, no downsider as I see it.

(4) It might be possible to return to the old pit for some of the RX days. I will check that out. The reason we gave it up was because it was so soft and required a lot of course fixup between runs. It is on Town of Bancroft property, so getting permission and the other perks should not be an issue.

(5) James is already considering a full weekend special event.


I don't want anyone to get the idea that we are not looking for other venues. We continue to do that. We have one that is halfway ready for us and want us, but have not finished building the course - kind of got stalled in the project. I will talk to them again.

You cannot underestimate the very important positives about the Bancroft venue(s). The support we get from the Town of Bancroft and the Golton property owners is HUGE and would cost us a lot of dollars if we went elsewhere. We have negotiated with other commercial property owners, but their fees for use of the property were way too high and would have put RX fees beyond grassroots level activity. We are trying to keep RX entry fees as low as possible. I assure you that this is NOT a major money-maker for MLRC and all individuals involved are giving their time purely on a volunteer basis.  You must also understand that almost all of the Bancroft benefits are riding on the coattails of the Tall Pines Rally. Because it provides such huge economic benefit to the area, we get the support for the RX. Also you have to understand that about half the money we currently spend on the RX track comes from Tall Pines budget indirectly via RSO road damage repairs.  I assure you the Tall Pines is not going to move anywhere else closer to Toronto in the near future.
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Re: 2011 FourStar MLRC Rallycross Championship
Reply #124 - 03/18/12 at 13:16:16
 
Please continue this conversation on the 2012 Can-Jam Rallycross Champion thread for RX locations going forward. Thank you.

James
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James Drake

MLRC Membership Chairman
MLRC Rallycross Coordinator
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